Comments for Lessonstream.org http://lessonstream.org Formerly TEFLClips, ELTON award winner. By Jamie Keddie. Fri, 17 Feb 2012 19:18:25 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 Comment on My favorite things by Jamie Keddie http://lessonstream.org/2011/09/24/my-favorite-things/comment-page-1/#comment-1027 Jamie Keddie Fri, 17 Feb 2012 19:18:25 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=2966#comment-1027 Thank you Lucrecia Jamie :) Thank you Lucrecia
Jamie :)

]]> Comment on My favorite things by Lucrecia http://lessonstream.org/2011/09/24/my-favorite-things/comment-page-1/#comment-1025 Lucrecia Fri, 17 Feb 2012 04:39:34 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=2966#comment-1025 I enjoyed it so much! This is what the art of teaching is about! I enjoyed it so much! This is what the art of teaching is about!

]]> Comment on Passive quiz by Stephen http://lessonstream.org/2011/07/14/passive-quiz/comment-page-1/#comment-1024 Stephen Thu, 16 Feb 2012 20:59:48 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=2869#comment-1024 I love this lesson, and have used it several times. Usually, I lazily use your quiz questions and superb slideshow. Only recently did I discover that when students type in some of the questions into Google for their homework, this very page will be among the top results! Time to come up with some of my I own I think! Thanks for the inspiration anyway =) I love this lesson, and have used it several times. Usually, I lazily use your quiz questions and superb slideshow. Only recently did I discover that when students type in some of the questions into Google for their homework, this very page will be among the top results! Time to come up with some of my I own I think! Thanks for the inspiration anyway =)

]]> Comment on Fairytale of New York by Tom http://lessonstream.org/2011/12/12/fairytale-in-new-york/comment-page-1/#comment-1022 Tom Tue, 14 Feb 2012 05:36:25 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=3232#comment-1022 I understand how conflicted you must feel: you worked hard making the present unit. You don’t want to waste it. But it taints you. Any serious professional aware of intergroup relations (ethnicity!) will note a decidedly and unnecessary negative portrayal of Irishness here. Yet following your own logic, the protagonist of the story is actually British and arrives in NYC from England! But you would not want to teach foreign people negative things about your own people, so why not dump it on an Anglo out-group! Most people won’t say anything, but you will be tainted as having ignorance. Indeed recent news came that a major research study found a strong correlation (inversely) between intelligence and racial prejudice. The 21st century is a new age recognizing that human existence depends on cooperation between all peoples; that racism is folly, for it is akin to shooting one’s own foot. The racial barriers you make could be what stops the next scientific discovery from saving your life! Fixing your present unit would be easy and reap big benefits. Otherwise, you will only live to regret it. I understand how conflicted you must feel: you worked hard making the present unit. You don’t want to waste it. But it taints you. Any serious professional aware of intergroup relations (ethnicity!) will note a decidedly and unnecessary negative portrayal of Irishness here.

Yet following your own logic, the protagonist of the story is actually British and arrives in NYC from England! But you would not want to teach foreign people negative things about your own people, so why not dump it on an Anglo out-group!

Most people won’t say anything, but you will be tainted as having ignorance. Indeed recent news came that a major research study found a strong correlation (inversely) between intelligence and racial prejudice. The 21st century is a new age recognizing that human existence depends on cooperation between all peoples; that racism is folly, for it is akin to shooting one’s own foot. The racial barriers you make could be what stops the next scientific discovery from saving your life!

Fixing your present unit would be easy and reap big benefits. Otherwise, you will only live to regret it.

]]> Comment on Super chill orangutan by Jamie Keddie http://lessonstream.org/2007/09/04/super-chill-orangutan/comment-page-1/#comment-1020 Jamie Keddie Mon, 13 Feb 2012 18:21:14 +0000 http://asdftestblog1.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/comment-test/#comment-1020 Glad you liked it Patricia. Thanks for the comment. Jamie :) Glad you liked it Patricia. Thanks for the comment.
Jamie :)

]]> Comment on Super chill orangutan by Patricia http://lessonstream.org/2007/09/04/super-chill-orangutan/comment-page-1/#comment-1019 Patricia Mon, 13 Feb 2012 17:59:27 +0000 http://asdftestblog1.wordpress.com/2007/09/04/comment-test/#comment-1019 Thanks so much for sharing this lesson plan. I'm a speech-language therapist and my students (native English speakers with language disorders) loved this! I tweaked it a bit and was able to use it to work on several targets. Great idea! Thanks so much for sharing this lesson plan. I’m a speech-language therapist and my students (native English speakers with language disorders) loved this! I tweaked it a bit and was able to use it to work on several targets. Great idea!

]]> Comment on Fairytale of New York by Jamie Keddie http://lessonstream.org/2011/12/12/fairytale-in-new-york/comment-page-1/#comment-1017 Jamie Keddie Mon, 13 Feb 2012 05:07:23 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=3232#comment-1017 Tom - I reiterate that the activity aim is to use interactive storytelling to communicate the same story that is told in the song. Irishness, alcoholism, substance abuse and homelessness are all there, even if reference to them is implicit. In some cases, that which was not so obvious became apparent after watching a number of interviews with the Pogues and those involved with the song. <br></br> However ... <br></br> After these exchanges, I feel that there are a number of aspects about this activity which could be improved. For example, it could be redesigned in such a way so as not to draw attention to the specific time, place and ethnicity of the protagonists. In that way it could be used to deal with the wider issues of immigration. <br></br> I will have a fresh look at it before Christmas 2012. In the mean time, it stays up with a comment at the top of the page (scroll up) which draws attention to your dispute. Tom – I reiterate that the activity aim is to use interactive storytelling to communicate the same story that is told in the song. Irishness, alcoholism, substance abuse and homelessness are all there, even if reference to them is implicit. In some cases, that which was not so obvious became apparent after watching a number of interviews with the Pogues and those involved with the song.

However …

After these exchanges, I feel that there are a number of aspects about this activity which could be improved. For example, it could be redesigned in such a way so as not to draw attention to the specific time, place and ethnicity of the protagonists. In that way it could be used to deal with the wider issues of immigration.

I will have a fresh look at it before Christmas 2012. In the mean time, it stays up with a comment at the top of the page (scroll up) which draws attention to your dispute.

]]> Comment on Fairytale of New York by Tom http://lessonstream.org/2011/12/12/fairytale-in-new-york/comment-page-1/#comment-1016 Tom Sun, 12 Feb 2012 09:40:50 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=3232#comment-1016 Truly I find this unit both shocking and unfortunate. I should think that you want to uphold high standards of professionalism. Perhaps you do and so you might want to consider the following. Shane MacGowan is not only a known drunk* but also a wannabe Irishman*; meaning that he was born in England and spend most of his life there*. As a known “plastic Paddy,” MacGowan is not authentically Irish.** Yet you falsely characterize the song and story as the telling about an Irish immigrant. In point of fact, you deliberately chose the character in the story/song as MacGowan himself and further falsely concluded that this character must be an Irish immigrant. Actually MacGowan is more British than Irish and so your whole thesis about its characterization and storyline is false. *See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shane_MacGowan ** See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_Paddy Even if this story involves Irish, you state that the dashing of the couples’ dream was due to “alcoholism, substance abuse and homelessness.” Was it? What grounds do you have to say so? None! It comes from your own inference. As you agreed Irish identity of the characters is not explicit. Besides the problem of your false assumptions is the fact that you have no educational purpose other than to reinvent, reinforce negative stereotypes about Irish. If you want to do that please don’t choose a non-Irish character of MacGowan! Make an authentic choice! You don’t provide any educational purpose other than showing “homelessness.” Yet you do so in the context of homelessness caused by addiction. Is that what you want to teach? That homelessness is caused by addiction? Yeah, tell that to the millions of homelessness around the world caused so by economic disruptions or the misfortune of birth. And you further shroud all of this in the false association of Irishness with addiction while never cautioning teachers/students against such false generalizations. You have a professional, if not ethical, responsibility to represent culture and their people with fairness and objectivity. Instead you have super-imposed a wannabe Irishman’s supposed story about an Irish couple in New York onto Irishness as something representatively so. If not, then why do you recommend students give the unnmamed couple, “Irish names,” two people you explain later are “bums”! Finally, you give no good reason for this topic of “homelessness at Christmas” and your choice of the MacGowan song. Of course homelessness is a social issue and could be a reasonable and appropriate topic for an ELT class. But you give no explanations for your topic and subject choices. We then can only conclude that you are promoting negative stereotypes about Irish. Again as I have pointed out, you have no solid grounds for making Irish the “bums” of the story. Thus your unit is racism against Irish. Truly I find this unit both shocking and unfortunate. I should think that you want to uphold high standards of professionalism. Perhaps you do and so you might want to consider the following.
Shane MacGowan is not only a known drunk* but also a wannabe Irishman*; meaning that he was born in England and spend most of his life there*. As a known “plastic Paddy,” MacGowan is not authentically Irish.** Yet you falsely characterize the song and story as the telling about an Irish immigrant. In point of fact, you deliberately chose the character in the story/song as MacGowan himself and further falsely concluded that this character must be an Irish immigrant. Actually MacGowan is more British than Irish and so your whole thesis about its characterization and storyline is false.
*See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shane_MacGowan
** See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plastic_Paddy
Even if this story involves Irish, you state that the dashing of the couples’ dream was due to “alcoholism, substance abuse and homelessness.” Was it? What grounds do you have to say so? None! It comes from your own inference. As you agreed Irish identity of the characters is not explicit.
Besides the problem of your false assumptions is the fact that you have no educational purpose other than to reinvent, reinforce negative stereotypes about Irish. If you want to do that please don’t choose a non-Irish character of MacGowan! Make an authentic choice!
You don’t provide any educational purpose other than showing “homelessness.” Yet you do so in the context of homelessness caused by addiction. Is that what you want to teach? That homelessness is caused by addiction? Yeah, tell that to the millions of homelessness around the world caused so by economic disruptions or the misfortune of birth.
And you further shroud all of this in the false association of Irishness with addiction while never cautioning teachers/students against such false generalizations. You have a professional, if not ethical, responsibility to represent culture and their people with fairness and objectivity. Instead you have super-imposed a wannabe Irishman’s supposed story about an Irish couple in New York onto Irishness as something representatively so. If not, then why do you recommend students give the unnmamed couple, “Irish names,” two people you explain later are “bums”!
Finally, you give no good reason for this topic of “homelessness at Christmas” and your choice of the MacGowan song. Of course homelessness is a social issue and could be a reasonable and appropriate topic for an ELT class. But you give no explanations for your topic and subject choices. We then can only conclude that you are promoting negative stereotypes about Irish. Again as I have pointed out, you have no solid grounds for making Irish the “bums” of the story. Thus your unit is racism against Irish.

]]> Comment on Fairytale of New York by Jamie Keddie http://lessonstream.org/2011/12/12/fairytale-in-new-york/comment-page-1/#comment-1015 Jamie Keddie Sat, 11 Feb 2012 00:31:13 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=3232#comment-1015 Tom I would hate to think that I am perpetuating a negative stereotype in any way. That would be completely the opposite aim of an educational site like this one. But after reading the lesson plan over again, I really don't think I am doing that. The activity sets out to tell the story that Shane MacGowan created, albeit through a different medium (i.e. an interactive storytelling rather than a song). And yes, at no point does the song state implicitly that the couple are Irish. But it would take quite a stretch of the imagination to suggest otherwise. The background, accents, the language, the cultural clues ... They are all there. At the end of the day, this is a very sad story about lost dreams. In a wider context, it could apply to numerous social or ethnical groups who have suffered and relocated somewhere in search of something better, or even just less bad. I believe that that is what the song is about and that is what the lesson plan is about. If I thought that it was contributing to a negative false stereotype in any way, then I would take it down. Thanks for your comment Jamie Tom

I would hate to think that I am perpetuating a negative stereotype in any way. That would be completely the opposite aim of an educational site like this one.

But after reading the lesson plan over again, I really don’t think I am doing that. The activity sets out to tell the story that Shane MacGowan created, albeit through a different medium (i.e. an interactive storytelling rather than a song).

And yes, at no point does the song state implicitly that the couple are Irish. But it would take quite a stretch of the imagination to suggest otherwise. The background, accents, the language, the cultural clues … They are all there.

At the end of the day, this is a very sad story about lost dreams. In a wider context, it could apply to numerous social or ethnical groups who have suffered and relocated somewhere in search of something better, or even just less bad. I believe that that is what the song is about and that is what the lesson plan is about.

If I thought that it was contributing to a negative false stereotype in any way, then I would take it down.

Thanks for your comment
Jamie

]]> Comment on Fairytale of New York by Tom http://lessonstream.org/2011/12/12/fairytale-in-new-york/comment-page-1/#comment-1012 Tom Wed, 08 Feb 2012 16:00:49 +0000 http://lessonstream.org/?p=3232#comment-1012 RACISM AGAINST IRISH. Shocking to find this unit here. Don't you have anything better to do than to further stereotypes about the Irish? You think you cover yourself by adding a link to a BBC article about the song; as if being British can be trusted!! The article ignores historical background (as you do too) of environmental factors that can explain themes of drinking or fighting in Irish popular culture; the horrible racism that Irish faced in the U.S. in earlier times (and in the UK till this day), and the stereotypes that such racism have spawn. Hardly can the average ELT/ESL teacher be expected to give an intelligent treatment of this background without reinventing or reinforcing stereotypes. I fail find anything in your material that shows you recognize your responsibility--professional, social, ethnical--to ensure that the material is used for a legitimate learning purpose rather than an ethnic putdown. Simply because the musicians and creator of the song/video were Irish doesn't mean it can be used in the mindless way that you have presented it here. Issues spring up about their purposes--artistic or commercial? Either way, you are way out of your depth for failing to see the implications. Furthermore, nothing in the song absolutely identifies the immigrant couple as Irish; yet you very much want to do so even by getting your students to give them Irish names! This couple could be of any nationality, so why not present it as so, making it more potentially useful and without manufacturing hate and racism toward another group of people? Again the BBC take on it and however "popular" it is in the UK does not absolve you of the racist use of the material as found here. Please exercise at least cultural sensitivity by removing this unit immediately. RACISM AGAINST IRISH. Shocking to find this unit here. Don’t you have anything better to do than to further stereotypes about the Irish?

You think you cover yourself by adding a link to a BBC article about the song; as if being British can be trusted!! The article ignores historical background (as you do too) of environmental factors that can explain themes of drinking or fighting in Irish popular culture; the horrible racism that Irish faced in the U.S. in earlier times (and in the UK till this day), and the stereotypes that such racism have spawn. Hardly can the average ELT/ESL teacher be expected to give an intelligent treatment of this background without reinventing or reinforcing stereotypes.

I fail find anything in your material that shows you recognize your responsibility–professional, social, ethnical–to ensure that the material is used for a legitimate learning purpose rather than an ethnic putdown.

Simply because the musicians and creator of the song/video were Irish doesn’t mean it can be used in the mindless way that you have presented it here. Issues spring up about their purposes–artistic or commercial? Either way, you are way out of your depth for failing to see the implications.

Furthermore, nothing in the song absolutely identifies the immigrant couple as Irish; yet you very much want to do so even by getting your students to give them Irish names! This couple could be of any nationality, so why not present it as so, making it more potentially useful and without manufacturing hate and racism toward another group of people?

Again the BBC take on it and however “popular” it is in the UK does not absolve you of the racist use of the material as found here. Please exercise at least cultural sensitivity by removing this unit immediately.

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